Talk:Middle class

Middle class
With respect to this edit: In classical economics middle class meant the bourgeoisie, as they came into existence between the aristocracy and the serfs, wealthy as the aristocracy, but still commoners. The petite bourgeoisie came to be called middle class in other contexts, for example as shopkeepers, Margaret Thatcher has a middle class background in that sense. Contemporary American usage is strange, derived as it is from focus groups, in that usage even poor working people are referred to, and refer to themselves as "middle class"; there is no "working class" included in that conceptual scheme. All American workers can be fairly referred to as privileged. The idea that they are worth $40 an hour while someone in Bangladesh is worth $35 a month is obviously not rational. User:Fred Bauder Talk 23:43, 20 December 2011 (MSK)
 * Please specify who has referred to the bourgeois as the middle class, provide citations if needed. For all I know in Marxism the middle class is the petit bourgeoisie, who either own small bussinesses or perform an 'administrative' job in a capitalist enterprise. See Petit/Petty bourgeoisie: http://www.marxists.org/glossary/terms/p/e.htm . Though many wage-earners (proletars) in the US are worth more than in most countries, they are still forced to work for an employer in order to survive. Thus (in a strict Marxist definition) they still fall under the definition of proletariat or working class. Also even in the USA there is a large amout of people who work in a capitalist bussiness and earn barely enough to survive. Therefore we can still talk about a privileged working class among American proletarians. -- 01:07, 21 December 2011 (MSK)
 * We seem to both be right, the usual basis of a good argument:

The 'Middle Class'

The term 'middle class' is used by Marxists -- including Marx and Engels themselves -- in two different ways:

Firstly, in the historical sense,

"... in the sense of... the French word 'bourgeoisie that possessing class which is differentiated from the so-called aristocracy (Friedrich Engels: Preface to 'The Condition of the Working Class in England: From Personal Observation and Authentic Sources', in: Karl Marx & Friedrich Engels: 'Collected Works', Volume 4; Moscow; 1975; p. 304).

secondly, when speaking of modern capitalist society, with the meaning of petty bourgeoisie', discussed in the next section. http://www.mltranslations.org/Britain/Marxclass.htm User:Fred Bauder Talk 03:04, 21 December 2011 (MSK)